while i've learned not to engage directly *there*
Post# of 43064
(Total Views: 502)
Posted On: 10/18/2020 3:13:33 PM
while i've learned not to engage directly *there* with Non Retails' *efforts*
it's always interesting to see what makes *some there* squirm
a few years back i did a post on Holders of PTOI shares .. it was a simple *math* post that took certs held and divided by I/O .. to see the average
the *usual* snarky *effort* lambasted me for pointing out that the DTC/CEDE holds 1 cert .. this 1 cert covers every colluding entity (aka brokerage firms) that *trade* (and loan out a % to NR) PTOI *shares* .. snark effort indirectly and unwittingly *confirmed* what i'd posted (from memory avg shares held per @ approx 250,000 shares)
my point remained that with those certs .. the *math* average for PTOI shares held per .. was *revealing* (as in low)
because by then some of us had interacted at length and recognized the *dilemma* NR (non retail) had with P2O's ability to execute
this version went *poof* .. go figure ..
=========================
quotes from this very venue (PTOI) .. re: *authoritative expertise* on the very subject of the DTC (CEDE) ..
the *response* back then was directed against my post of *averages*
specific to *shares* held by actual P2O investors (PTOI & MATH)
============
the issue NR (non retail) has always had re: the *stock* is P2O investors .. many of whom have never sold one share
info from April 2009/May 2009
early original investors numbered 58,621,250 shares out of (at the time)
an I/O 63,700,000 (this was April 2009/May 2009)
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/14156...s1_jbi.htm
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/13811...q33109.htm
The April 2009 filing indicated an intent for sales of 9,697,375 shares ..
reminder cost basis in relation to *PPS* once a pubco and of *course* the volume that was done per month ..
TOTAL PTOI Shares Traded From April 2009 - EO 9.20 = 268,159,857
fast forward to post aromatic flush (2014) .. you can see above the *washed* effort of 2013/2014 of 36M~ and change .. and from that point on PTOI *shares* (volume) decreases significantly
reminder X aromatics' *last effort to reset* PTOI's 52 week low of 6c to 5c in October 2014 was to *bury* the release of the ACC Executive Summary
ACC did an update in 2019 re: projections
NRs' issue remains P2O investors/PTOI & MATH .. PPS has been held
for 6 years this month (with few exceptions) @ sub 5c
this is done by NR to cripple mgmt's ability to execute
it is a specialty on the OTC and at a guess is *successful* about 99% of the time
the key for those OTC targets who outlast/survive NRs' efforts gets very interesting with mgmt's ability to execute
having noted the *trades* and *volume* on PTOI for over a decade
i find certain pattern change outs *intriguing* (2019 comes to mind)
in working basic averages being *au fait* with some actual P2O investors' shares held .. and with a known (and increased) count now of 472 (up from 450) .. 1 of which covers every *share* .. snicker indeed .. held @ the DTC for all those *firms* who trade equities .. snort x 2
founder (who confirmed years back his hold of 3M~ PTOI shares which i suspect may actually be higher 4 years on) noted directly to a query of 1000s of investors ..
i'll use 1500 for investors (but any input can be injected) ..
472 - 1(DTC) = 471 certs
1 DTC cert = 87,509,624
From TA last November
PTOI AS ~ 250M
PTOI IO ~ 124,756,158
PTOI RS ~ 31,899,043
PTOI FF ~ 92,857,115
From OTC Mkts Friday
Outstanding Shares
124,756,158
Restricted
31,893,743
Unrestricted
92,862,415
Held at DTC
87,509,624
so the *first* illegally orchestrated run on PTOI by NR in December 2009 *failed* .. yep it took PPS to plus $7.00 .. but it failed to part more than X number of shares out of actual investors
we know that because of the volume total for that month reported by CEs to Finra .. 2525806(12.2009)/268159857(volume totals 4.2009 - 9.2020) = .00941903%
NR knew they had problems immediately .. (hand off into 2010)
so one sees NRs' classic *go to* of *volume injection* as they relentlessly compress *stock* downward with the occasional round robin effort (Dec 2010 comes to mind from memory 70c to 1.35 to 70c in 1 *trading* day)
to be clear NR can almost always count on this *effort* succeeding
but as was known *then* by some .. many early original investors held certs .. never deposited in any brokerage firm
so back to PTOI *shares* & MATH
if one takes every holder regardless of where *held*
124,756,158 (issued/outstanding) divided by 1500 investors
that works out to 83,170 PTOI shares per investor
now clearly if the DTC holds *shares* for every firm trading PTOI
one has to take that into account .. snicker/snort on steroids
so 1500 - 471 (certs) = 1029 investors at such firms as FIDO/TDA/ETRADE/USAA yada yada)
87,509,624 divided by 1029 works out to 85,043 PTOI shares per investor
now that (average) might have been the case back in 2010 - 2014
but since aromatics were flushed out of PTOI and *PPS compression*
2014 - 2020 .. *averages* for many actual P2O investors have increased
there is (and has been for years) ongoing involvement with approx 200 P2O investors
some of whom retain every PTOI *share* from 2008/2009 onward
some of whom are *newbies* like me (invested from November 2009)
and as noted many X previously while some have never DCA'd PTOI shares .. many others have
in just the last 2 days of *trading* this past week .. one long
picked off 12k and another investor picked off 26k
so when factoring in a very small % wise group of known P2O investors (15 to 20)
who hold respectively between 1M~ and 2M~ PTOI *shares* (open market not private placement)
it makes for some interesting variances regarding those *averages* held by the DTC
if/when P2O executes (for me that is first sale with deposit funds' conveyed)
NR has a few problems with a *FAKE* but relentless compression of PTOI's PPS and an inability to part actual P2O investors from their *shares*
imo depending on the size of said first sale deposit (and how articulated by P2O re: logistics and time frame in play) PTOI will see a rise in her PPS ..
i've noted for years .. NRs' *metrics* re: specific price points
$1.50 has been revealing due to $1.49 being the last price when NR last illegally ran PTOI up .. of significance (Jan 2013) b4 resetting yet again
$1.50 to me is equally compelling for another reason .. early/original investors' initial cost ..
i'm speculating here .. but i would suspect that P2O's *goal* is to retain decade long investors as much as possible with company's execution
i can see that happening with NF facility back in operation (or partnering with a site in NY like OBG if intent is to sell NF) .. BoD expansion .. international sale/s .. digital token and/or cash div .. mgmt change out .. uplisting (these are just some of the options P2O retains .. there are others but until P2O's first sale is consummated .. it's just another topic that can be held for discussion)
NR = 10 years and 100 Million reasons for wanting P2O *to fail*
4kids
it's always interesting to see what makes *some there* squirm
a few years back i did a post on Holders of PTOI shares .. it was a simple *math* post that took certs held and divided by I/O .. to see the average
the *usual* snarky *effort* lambasted me for pointing out that the DTC/CEDE holds 1 cert .. this 1 cert covers every colluding entity (aka brokerage firms) that *trade* (and loan out a % to NR) PTOI *shares* .. snark effort indirectly and unwittingly *confirmed* what i'd posted (from memory avg shares held per @ approx 250,000 shares)
my point remained that with those certs .. the *math* average for PTOI shares held per .. was *revealing* (as in low)
because by then some of us had interacted at length and recognized the *dilemma* NR (non retail) had with P2O's ability to execute
this version went *poof* .. go figure ..
=========================
quotes from this very venue (PTOI) .. re: *authoritative expertise* on the very subject of the DTC (CEDE) ..
Quote:
On April 7, 2017, there were 482 holders of record of our common stock, $0.001 par value per share.
Well, 481 who were crazy enough to give them their name and all the others with street name are in CEDE.
Quote:
every public company has a shareholder of record named CEDE that counts as 1 in the # of shareholders of record...that "entity" is the nominee owner of all shares held by all beneficial owners at various brokerages who may number in the thousands...
Quote:
CEDE, who is the nominee holder of every share held in a brokerage account and counts as 1 shareholder of record
Quote:
One of those "entities"---the nominee holder of every share held in brokerage accounts called CEDE---counts as 1 and represents thousands of shareholders...
Quote:
incredible how, with ~500 shareholders of record, (one of whom is CEDE, the nominee of the DTC that is the legal owner of every street named shareholder's shares) anyone could even fathom a guess on this...
the *response* back then was directed against my post of *averages*
specific to *shares* held by actual P2O investors (PTOI & MATH)
============
the issue NR (non retail) has always had re: the *stock* is P2O investors .. many of whom have never sold one share
info from April 2009/May 2009
early original investors numbered 58,621,250 shares out of (at the time)
an I/O 63,700,000 (this was April 2009/May 2009)
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/14156...s1_jbi.htm
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/13811...q33109.htm
The April 2009 filing indicated an intent for sales of 9,697,375 shares ..
reminder cost basis in relation to *PPS* once a pubco and of *course* the volume that was done per month ..
PTOI ~ Annual Volume Totals:
2009 ~ 7,188,642 ** (mid April start) NRs' setup Dec 2009 ***
2010 ~ 20,478,838 ** CSTI imported/first hit piece & complicit *letter* of 9/28/2010
2011 ~ 37,204,277 ** NON RETAILs' *set up* .. (includes April's then record setting *volume* month of 8M~)
2012 ~ 26,989,328 ** aromatics & mgmt change out May 2012 .. set up for Jan 2013
2013 ~ 36,808,995 ** P2O wrested back mid August 2013 .. wash trading 101 with 2014
2014 ~ 36,381,060 ** wash trading 101 with 2013 .. note lower than 2013 and Jan 2014 6c reset and *volume*
2015 ~ 22,275,997 ** note *volume* significantly lower than 2014 .. PPS relentlessly compressed
2016 ~ 19,759,799 ** note still the lowest YTD volume for PTOI with lowest PPS
2017 ~ 13,540,583 ** down approx 6M and change from 2016's record setting low *volume*
2018 ~ 13,924,427 .. slight increase over 2017's 13M~ *volume* .. first turn since 2013
2019 ~ 23,994,633 ** November 2019 record set up replaces April 2011's record set up by approx 800k *volume* zero PPS correlation
2020 ~ 9,613,278 .. YTD Thru EO Sept 2020
TOTAL PTOI Shares Traded From April 2009 - EO 9.20 = 268,159,857
fast forward to post aromatic flush (2014) .. you can see above the *washed* effort of 2013/2014 of 36M~ and change .. and from that point on PTOI *shares* (volume) decreases significantly
reminder X aromatics' *last effort to reset* PTOI's 52 week low of 6c to 5c in October 2014 was to *bury* the release of the ACC Executive Summary
ACC did an update in 2019 re: projections
NRs' issue remains P2O investors/PTOI & MATH .. PPS has been held
for 6 years this month (with few exceptions) @ sub 5c
this is done by NR to cripple mgmt's ability to execute
it is a specialty on the OTC and at a guess is *successful* about 99% of the time
the key for those OTC targets who outlast/survive NRs' efforts gets very interesting with mgmt's ability to execute
having noted the *trades* and *volume* on PTOI for over a decade
i find certain pattern change outs *intriguing* (2019 comes to mind)
in working basic averages being *au fait* with some actual P2O investors' shares held .. and with a known (and increased) count now of 472 (up from 450) .. 1 of which covers every *share* .. snicker indeed .. held @ the DTC for all those *firms* who trade equities .. snort x 2
founder (who confirmed years back his hold of 3M~ PTOI shares which i suspect may actually be higher 4 years on) noted directly to a query of 1000s of investors ..
i'll use 1500 for investors (but any input can be injected) ..
472 - 1(DTC) = 471 certs
1 DTC cert = 87,509,624
From TA last November
PTOI AS ~ 250M
PTOI IO ~ 124,756,158
PTOI RS ~ 31,899,043
PTOI FF ~ 92,857,115
From OTC Mkts Friday
Outstanding Shares
124,756,158
Restricted
31,893,743
Unrestricted
92,862,415
Held at DTC
87,509,624
so the *first* illegally orchestrated run on PTOI by NR in December 2009 *failed* .. yep it took PPS to plus $7.00 .. but it failed to part more than X number of shares out of actual investors
we know that because of the volume total for that month reported by CEs to Finra .. 2525806(12.2009)/268159857(volume totals 4.2009 - 9.2020) = .00941903%
DEC 2009 ~ Total Share Volume 2,525,806 $orchestration (initial run 1M abusive)
NR knew they had problems immediately .. (hand off into 2010)
so one sees NRs' classic *go to* of *volume injection* as they relentlessly compress *stock* downward with the occasional round robin effort (Dec 2010 comes to mind from memory 70c to 1.35 to 70c in 1 *trading* day)
to be clear NR can almost always count on this *effort* succeeding
but as was known *then* by some .. many early original investors held certs .. never deposited in any brokerage firm
so back to PTOI *shares* & MATH
if one takes every holder regardless of where *held*
124,756,158 (issued/outstanding) divided by 1500 investors
that works out to 83,170 PTOI shares per investor
now clearly if the DTC holds *shares* for every firm trading PTOI
one has to take that into account .. snicker/snort on steroids
so 1500 - 471 (certs) = 1029 investors at such firms as FIDO/TDA/ETRADE/USAA yada yada)
87,509,624 divided by 1029 works out to 85,043 PTOI shares per investor
now that (average) might have been the case back in 2010 - 2014
but since aromatics were flushed out of PTOI and *PPS compression*
2014 - 2020 .. *averages* for many actual P2O investors have increased
there is (and has been for years) ongoing involvement with approx 200 P2O investors
some of whom retain every PTOI *share* from 2008/2009 onward
some of whom are *newbies* like me (invested from November 2009)
and as noted many X previously while some have never DCA'd PTOI shares .. many others have
in just the last 2 days of *trading* this past week .. one long
picked off 12k and another investor picked off 26k
so when factoring in a very small % wise group of known P2O investors (15 to 20)
who hold respectively between 1M~ and 2M~ PTOI *shares* (open market not private placement)
it makes for some interesting variances regarding those *averages* held by the DTC
15 x 1M = 15M
20 x 1M = 20M
15 x 1.5M = 22.5M
20 x 1.5M = 30M
15 x 2M = 30M
20 x 2M = 40M
15 x 2.5M = 37.5M
20 x 2.5M = 50M
if/when P2O executes (for me that is first sale with deposit funds' conveyed)
NR has a few problems with a *FAKE* but relentless compression of PTOI's PPS and an inability to part actual P2O investors from their *shares*
imo depending on the size of said first sale deposit (and how articulated by P2O re: logistics and time frame in play) PTOI will see a rise in her PPS ..
i've noted for years .. NRs' *metrics* re: specific price points
20c (proved summer 2014)
30c to 35c (2013)
50c to 70c (2013)
1.25 to 1.50 (2012/2013)
$1.50 has been revealing due to $1.49 being the last price when NR last illegally ran PTOI up .. of significance (Jan 2013) b4 resetting yet again
$1.50 to me is equally compelling for another reason .. early/original investors' initial cost ..
i'm speculating here .. but i would suspect that P2O's *goal* is to retain decade long investors as much as possible with company's execution
i can see that happening with NF facility back in operation (or partnering with a site in NY like OBG if intent is to sell NF) .. BoD expansion .. international sale/s .. digital token and/or cash div .. mgmt change out .. uplisting (these are just some of the options P2O retains .. there are others but until P2O's first sale is consummated .. it's just another topic that can be held for discussion)
NR = 10 years and 100 Million reasons for wanting P2O *to fail*
4kids
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