LEHNQ News 08/17/2014 01:29:59 $LEHNQ
Better get more familiar before you make a decision to buy. Don't be fooled by others. You will hear "slap the ask" or buy the asking price of the lowest of the four Cts. The "slap the ask " have been used here since after the bankruptcy six years ago and some people get trapped in buying.
You will also hear a lie that you will receive some cash every time the scheduled distribution to creditor is coming close.
The only game in this stock is the NET OPERATING LOSS or NOL. This is a tax attribute of LBHI losses of about 55B dollars that is owned by the equity holders.
The remaining asset after the total of 80B is distributed is about 43B while the deficit is still more than 200B after all of the asset is distributed.
Good luck if you like the challenge.
It may take a long wait or it may take sooner if they start to put the NOL into use.
Who cares about where we rank. You need to eat nails for breakfast to invest in a BK company. Most investors have been here for over 5 years. Trying to trade any CT's of Lehman Brothers is plain stupid.
The risk/reward is very extreme and if you understand that, then you can make an intelligent/speculative decision. Lehman Capitol Trust shares have a face value of $25.00 with accrued dividends.
This is not a quick trade for beer money. Volume is very low on a daily basis.
RickNagra - A somewhat odd comment since you once posted on the WMIH board.
LEHNQ is a capital trust security along with LEHKQ, LEHLQ and LHHMQ. Dig into some bankruptcy due diligence on capital trust shares and well everything Lehman Chapter 11.
Don't forget to smack or slap the ask while you're analyzing the past several years of information. We certainly need the number of trades to more closely resemble the number of posts on this board.
What's funny (I hope you think so too) is that the LEH in the symbol stands for Lehman Brothers, which is in the end stages of it's bankruptcy, that being the largest bankruptcy in history. I think most people assume they are dead and buried, but I believe they are going to come back with a "bankrupt this" attitude. Plenty of NOLs available so they definitely make a great candidate for a merger at some point.
This symbol is for the $25 face value Capital Trust (CT) preferred shares. The dividends are cumulative and should be around $10/share on top of the FV since they've been accumulating for about 6 years now.
There are 3 other symbols for similar $25 CT shares, those being LEHKQ, LEHLQ, and LHHMQ.
The CTs haven't received a distribution yet but the expectation is that the next one (Oct 2nd) could be when we do. The distributions are semi-annual and the debtor has paid about $80B to creditors so far. It sounds like they should have another $8B for the Oct distribtution.
Cotton,
According to the Prospectus, LBI was acting as the representative for the underwriters...
"Holdings, in turn, has agreed to sell to each of the underwriters named below, and each of the underwriters, for whom Lehman Brothers Inc is acting as the representative, has severally agreed to purchase from Holdings the number of preferred securities set forth opposite its name below".
So LBI was the representative for the underwriters and LBHI has the $1.7B subrogated JPM claim against LBI as part of the CDA.
Perhaps more evidence of the $1.7B claim against LBI being associated with the CTs???
OK so you're in the top 10 now. Most of us have never even heard of you and your company LEHNQ. Can one of you bring of all us up to speed as to what is going on ? None of us know. Thanks.
LMFAO!! Cotton, you think creditors will not scream if they cut the distribution any time they want? What kind of reasoning you have in your mind?
I am asking you now Cotton.
Do you know the rights and power of the creditor?
One Word.. Exactly!
The entire group just voted on extending the stay on August 12, 2014. After their meeting, not one single creditor filed an objection to the stay extension. This is the exact same way that satisfied in full will be determined in this bankruptcy.
It will be in the best interest of the chapter 11 Estate when satisfied in full is achieved in this bankruptcy.
I like the artwork below too!
Perhaps, we will never know; since the stay was extended on August 12, 2014; how many CT holders were going to go after JPMC in state court, as codebtor with LBHI, for their principal and back interest.
JPMC assert claims against LBHI for underwriting the same set of securities listed in Exhibit C with our CTs. Had the stay extension failed on August 12, 2014, JPMC would have paid our CT claims off in state court and pressed LBHI to pay their asserted underwriting claims. This is one reason why LBHI want to settle all of its creditors claim against JPMC before the stay is lifted. To prevent us CT holders from going after JPMC as codebtor.
Note: The leading underwriters are on the hook for the CTs guarantee agreement: JPMSI and Bear Stearns.
****
Quote:
"In addition, JPMSI and its Affiliates, each as an entity that may be liable with LBHI to a creditor that has not filed a proof of claim, hereby files pursuant to Bankruptcy Rule 3005(a) a proof of claim on behalf of each such creditor covering claims with respect to which JPMSI and the affiliate of JPMSI, as applicable, is a codebtor with LBHI. The name of each such creditor is not currently known"
Satisfied in full = When the Debtors and Board of Directors and US Trustee feel like the creditors are satisfied in full (a group decision and vote).
+++++++++++
"The board of directors and US trustee vote...... Blah blah blah.,,,"
///\\
Hmmm.. Anytime they feel like it huh?
1. This is the real proof of ignorance for not even understanding the creditors right to collect their money.
2. No knowledge of creditors power to claim or to take over (a coup) the entire company in case of a breach of contract by LBHI.
3. Or even if he think that it is possible, he must show a proof of such decision...
4. He is now changing the "satisfied in full " from the 65B mark into the debtors and board's decision ignoring the creditors right.
HEY HESTHEMAN! .. WHAT ABOUT YOUR POSITION??
What do you mean?
Now I'm stumped. I don't see how CTs fit in there.
If you are asking about "THESE general unsecured creditors" I assume you are talking about those getting the $4.6 billion Sept. distribution.
LBI has its own gen. uns. creditors that will be receiving a payment in Sept. However, LBHI is also a rather large gen. uns. cred. of LBI and will be expecting some of that Sept. payout.
If you are asking who is a general unsecured creditor of LBHI then:
"1.60 General Unsecured Claim means, (a) in the case of LBHI, any Claim other than an Administrative Expense Claim, a Priority Tax Claim, a Priority Non-Tax Claim, a Secured Claim, a Senior Unsecured Claim, a Senior Affiliate Claim, a Senior Affiliate Guarantee Claim, a Senior Third-Party Guarantee Claim, an Affiliate Claim, a Third-Party Guarantee Claim, a Subordinated Claim or a Section 510(b) Claim,..."
And then you can match those up to the following to see which classes are general unsecured and I think you are left with just Class 7:
LBHI Class 1 – Priority Non-Tax Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 2 – Secured Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 3 – Senior Unsecured Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 4A – Senior Affiliate Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 4B – Senior Affiliate Guarantee Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 5 – Senior Third-Party Guarantee Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 6A – Convenience Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 6B – Convenience Guarantee Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 7 – General Unsecured Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 8 – Affiliate Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 9A – Third-Party Guarantee Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 9B – Third-Party Guarantee Claims of the Racers
Trusts against LBHI
LBHI Class 10A – Subordinated Class 10A Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 10B – Subordinated Class 10B Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 10C – Subordinated Class 10C Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 11 – Section 510(b) Claims against LBHI
"...or (b) in the case of each Subsidiary Debtor, any Claim other than an Administrative Expense Claim, a Priority Tax Claim, a Priority Non-Tax Claim, a Secured Claim or an Affiliate Claim."
But I don't know if LBI is a Subsidiary Debtor.
Sorry, of classes 1-11 as defined int the POR...who are these gen unsecured creditors.
Quote:
Od 1-11,
?
Od 1-11, whom are they?
The last paragraph of your post is my point exactly.
I am sure that Cotton will have a better answer than I do but I'll try.
LBI's Trustee is paying LBI's unsecured creditors back $4.6 billion in the Sept. distribution.
We are LBHI. LBHI is an unsecured creditor of LBI's with at least $3 billion in claims.
So LBHI will be getting some more money in September to add to the $8.3 billion "unexpectedly" recovered since April 2014.
LBHI's 6th distribution will be coming October 2nd.
As far as "Wouldn't they fight that tooth and nail?", they already agreed to take less. It is a bankruptcy after all, they could've gotten nothing. They can't renegotiate what they agreed on 2 years ago just because the economy has improved.
Better get more familiar before you make a decision to buy. Don't be fooled by others. You will hear "slap the ask" or buy the asking price of the lowest of the four Cts. The "slap the ask " have been used here since after the bankruptcy six years ago and some people get trapped in buying.
You will also hear a lie that you will receive some cash every time the scheduled distribution to creditor is coming close.
The only game in this stock is the NET OPERATING LOSS or NOL. This is a tax attribute of LBHI losses of about 55B dollars that is owned by the equity holders.
The remaining asset after the total of 80B is distributed is about 43B while the deficit is still more than 200B after all of the asset is distributed.
Good luck if you like the challenge.
It may take a long wait or it may take sooner if they start to put the NOL into use.
Who cares about where we rank. You need to eat nails for breakfast to invest in a BK company. Most investors have been here for over 5 years. Trying to trade any CT's of Lehman Brothers is plain stupid.
The risk/reward is very extreme and if you understand that, then you can make an intelligent/speculative decision. Lehman Capitol Trust shares have a face value of $25.00 with accrued dividends.
This is not a quick trade for beer money. Volume is very low on a daily basis.
RickNagra - A somewhat odd comment since you once posted on the WMIH board.
LEHNQ is a capital trust security along with LEHKQ, LEHLQ and LHHMQ. Dig into some bankruptcy due diligence on capital trust shares and well everything Lehman Chapter 11.
Don't forget to smack or slap the ask while you're analyzing the past several years of information. We certainly need the number of trades to more closely resemble the number of posts on this board.
What's funny (I hope you think so too) is that the LEH in the symbol stands for Lehman Brothers, which is in the end stages of it's bankruptcy, that being the largest bankruptcy in history. I think most people assume they are dead and buried, but I believe they are going to come back with a "bankrupt this" attitude. Plenty of NOLs available so they definitely make a great candidate for a merger at some point.
This symbol is for the $25 face value Capital Trust (CT) preferred shares. The dividends are cumulative and should be around $10/share on top of the FV since they've been accumulating for about 6 years now.
There are 3 other symbols for similar $25 CT shares, those being LEHKQ, LEHLQ, and LHHMQ.
The CTs haven't received a distribution yet but the expectation is that the next one (Oct 2nd) could be when we do. The distributions are semi-annual and the debtor has paid about $80B to creditors so far. It sounds like they should have another $8B for the Oct distribtution.
Cotton,
According to the Prospectus, LBI was acting as the representative for the underwriters...
"Holdings, in turn, has agreed to sell to each of the underwriters named below, and each of the underwriters, for whom Lehman Brothers Inc is acting as the representative, has severally agreed to purchase from Holdings the number of preferred securities set forth opposite its name below".
So LBI was the representative for the underwriters and LBHI has the $1.7B subrogated JPM claim against LBI as part of the CDA.
Perhaps more evidence of the $1.7B claim against LBI being associated with the CTs???
OK so you're in the top 10 now. Most of us have never even heard of you and your company LEHNQ. Can one of you bring of all us up to speed as to what is going on ? None of us know. Thanks.
LMFAO!! Cotton, you think creditors will not scream if they cut the distribution any time they want? What kind of reasoning you have in your mind?
I am asking you now Cotton.
Do you know the rights and power of the creditor?
One Word.. Exactly!
The entire group just voted on extending the stay on August 12, 2014. After their meeting, not one single creditor filed an objection to the stay extension. This is the exact same way that satisfied in full will be determined in this bankruptcy.
It will be in the best interest of the chapter 11 Estate when satisfied in full is achieved in this bankruptcy.
I like the artwork below too!
Perhaps, we will never know; since the stay was extended on August 12, 2014; how many CT holders were going to go after JPMC in state court, as codebtor with LBHI, for their principal and back interest.
JPMC assert claims against LBHI for underwriting the same set of securities listed in Exhibit C with our CTs. Had the stay extension failed on August 12, 2014, JPMC would have paid our CT claims off in state court and pressed LBHI to pay their asserted underwriting claims. This is one reason why LBHI want to settle all of its creditors claim against JPMC before the stay is lifted. To prevent us CT holders from going after JPMC as codebtor.
Note: The leading underwriters are on the hook for the CTs guarantee agreement: JPMSI and Bear Stearns.
****
Quote:
"In addition, JPMSI and its Affiliates, each as an entity that may be liable with LBHI to a creditor that has not filed a proof of claim, hereby files pursuant to Bankruptcy Rule 3005(a) a proof of claim on behalf of each such creditor covering claims with respect to which JPMSI and the affiliate of JPMSI, as applicable, is a codebtor with LBHI. The name of each such creditor is not currently known"
Satisfied in full = When the Debtors and Board of Directors and US Trustee feel like the creditors are satisfied in full (a group decision and vote).
+++++++++++
"The board of directors and US trustee vote...... Blah blah blah.,,,"
///\\
Hmmm.. Anytime they feel like it huh?
1. This is the real proof of ignorance for not even understanding the creditors right to collect their money.
2. No knowledge of creditors power to claim or to take over (a coup) the entire company in case of a breach of contract by LBHI.
3. Or even if he think that it is possible, he must show a proof of such decision...
4. He is now changing the "satisfied in full " from the 65B mark into the debtors and board's decision ignoring the creditors right.
HEY HESTHEMAN! .. WHAT ABOUT YOUR POSITION??
What do you mean?
Now I'm stumped. I don't see how CTs fit in there.
If you are asking about "THESE general unsecured creditors" I assume you are talking about those getting the $4.6 billion Sept. distribution.
LBI has its own gen. uns. creditors that will be receiving a payment in Sept. However, LBHI is also a rather large gen. uns. cred. of LBI and will be expecting some of that Sept. payout.
If you are asking who is a general unsecured creditor of LBHI then:
"1.60 General Unsecured Claim means, (a) in the case of LBHI, any Claim other than an Administrative Expense Claim, a Priority Tax Claim, a Priority Non-Tax Claim, a Secured Claim, a Senior Unsecured Claim, a Senior Affiliate Claim, a Senior Affiliate Guarantee Claim, a Senior Third-Party Guarantee Claim, an Affiliate Claim, a Third-Party Guarantee Claim, a Subordinated Claim or a Section 510(b) Claim,..."
And then you can match those up to the following to see which classes are general unsecured and I think you are left with just Class 7:
LBHI Class 1 – Priority Non-Tax Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 2 – Secured Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 3 – Senior Unsecured Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 4A – Senior Affiliate Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 4B – Senior Affiliate Guarantee Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 5 – Senior Third-Party Guarantee Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 6A – Convenience Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 6B – Convenience Guarantee Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 7 – General Unsecured Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 8 – Affiliate Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 9A – Third-Party Guarantee Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 9B – Third-Party Guarantee Claims of the Racers
Trusts against LBHI
LBHI Class 10A – Subordinated Class 10A Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 10B – Subordinated Class 10B Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 10C – Subordinated Class 10C Claims against LBHI
LBHI Class 11 – Section 510(b) Claims against LBHI
"...or (b) in the case of each Subsidiary Debtor, any Claim other than an Administrative Expense Claim, a Priority Tax Claim, a Priority Non-Tax Claim, a Secured Claim or an Affiliate Claim."
But I don't know if LBI is a Subsidiary Debtor.
Sorry, of classes 1-11 as defined int the POR...who are these gen unsecured creditors.
Quote:
Od 1-11,
?
Od 1-11, whom are they?
The last paragraph of your post is my point exactly.
I am sure that Cotton will have a better answer than I do but I'll try.
LBI's Trustee is paying LBI's unsecured creditors back $4.6 billion in the Sept. distribution.
We are LBHI. LBHI is an unsecured creditor of LBI's with at least $3 billion in claims.
So LBHI will be getting some more money in September to add to the $8.3 billion "unexpectedly" recovered since April 2014.
LBHI's 6th distribution will be coming October 2nd.
As far as "Wouldn't they fight that tooth and nail?", they already agreed to take less. It is a bankruptcy after all, they could've gotten nothing. They can't renegotiate what they agreed on 2 years ago just because the economy has improved.
